The more you learn, the more you realize how little you know…
Have you noticed how the more you learn, the more you realize how little you know. This amazing piece of literary genius has been attributed to Socrates, by Plato, but that needs to be confirmed. It doesn’t really matter who said it, it’s just important that it was said, and needs to be understood.
For those who are not afraid to explore and learn, this paradox will become apparent soon enough. Your quest and thirst for knowledge will leave you extremely frustrated. Each new thing you learn will lead you to another new thing, and another, and so on. The more you uncover, the more remains hidden, that needs to be sought out and exposed. It is ultimately impossible to know everything. That is what makes life so fascinating, and also what will be my greatest regret on my deathbed; not knowing what new things I could have learned if I’d lived longer. For me, there can be nothing sadder than this, but if it’s true what they say about your life flashing before your eyes on your deathbed, then I’m sure to have one heck of a long flashback, crammed with all the things I’ve learned.
It’s no coincidence then, that this should lead me to criticise religion for the part it has played over the years, and still does in advocating closed thinking, and discouraging the pursuit of knowledge. It is well known that knowledge leads one to question, and awkward questions are anathema to religion. Religious texts such as the Bible, even advocated that knowledge is forbidden; only the Gods are supposed to possess it. For years (happily gone by), the religious establishment preached that all knowledge was already revealed within the context of “religious” doctrine, and that there was no need for the individual to pursue it on his or her own. For this reason, the scientific and academic community were harassed and vilified. It is still happening today. Bigoted, religious communities still refuse to believe scientific discoveries; evolution being one.
Luckily, for most of us, the thirst for knowledge is greater than the fear of Gods…
Find out what's on my mind
i agree with the saying, the more you learn, the more you realize how little you know. i agree that knowledge is something we must always strive for. that’s why ‘life-long learning’ is the way to go. but i disagree with you if you say all religion discourages knowledge gaining. its definitely not in Islam.
in a hadith, the messenger of God, Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) said: “To gain knowledge is a duty of every Muslim, male or female”. i also quote someone who once said, “Knowledge precedes faith. How can one have faith without knowing what it is that one has faith in?” just like converts..they enter the religion voluntarily..and thus must have sought knowledge to reach an understanding of that religion, to want to be leading that religious life.
in my humble opinion, our thirst for knowledge is best when it is in the way of God. some things you can learn by reading. but some things you learn by going through life. He IS the Creator after all. He knows what’s good for you. and you’re only ONE out of how many people on this planet?? yet, every one of us has our paths..and we get to make decisions. He has guided us, through His books. it’s just up to us to read and embrace His words. but at the end of it…you still have a choice. and whatever the choice you make..He will see you get things fair. He is Most Fair. at the same time, He is Merciful, Most Kind.
try the Qur’an..the book of Allah. try Islam, the way of life.
I understand what you’re saying, even if Lenny doesn’t. I guess knowledge only applies to atheists.
Sure you would; you’ve grasped onto something that offered you a lifeline (an escape), and now you think it is the whole world, and nothing else matters as much. Hard drugs does much the same thing, but I’m glad you didn’t opt for that route. Consider this quote from Byron Danelius “Religion provides the solace for the turmoil it creates.”
Correction: Knowledge worth having applies to atheists…
Spoken like one who has a captured mind; captured and hitched to the yolk of religion that is. Religion is not concerned with disseminating any knowledge; any meaningful knowledge at any rate. Religion is concerned with subjugation of the mind. Religion (abetted by the clerics of course) only allows you to learn what religion wants you to learn, so that you (and your mind) remains chained to it in perpetuity.
I care not an ounce for your religion and your holy book. I want to learn reality; not superstitious dogma compiled by men ignorant of a great many realities which their writings endeniably reveal.
i agree with you, if you can see how ‘ignorant men’ have destroyed the beauty of religion. and by religion, i mean those that came from God and His books (Psalms, Torah, Bible and Qur’an) and His prophets. if we truly seek knowledge, we can find it in these books. the idea is: read and ask questions
now, the problem is..i think, it’s when HUMANS try and interpret on their own what is written, and how it is applied to real life. THAT is when things become out of order. when God demands somethng..it really is for the greater good. the problem with human beings is..we take things to the extreme.
that’s why we need to seek knowledge. say suicide bombings. Muslims call it jihad. first things first..suicide is something God HATES. and second, the killing of innocent people is condemned and will be regarded as MURDER. so what’s so jihad’ish about suicide bombers??
even i condemned it..until i discovered something someone wrote. what if..you are attacked, say like Palestine. and yet, you have nothing..no fighter planes, no missile launchers, no bomb squad..nothing. and your people are dying, your country is blown up, wrecked. dead. your people are being wiped out. you send a jihadist to blow himself up..and you know, as a walking person..he can go right to target and blow up.
now, the term ‘terrorist’. we’ve heard enough about Muslim terrorists. nobody supports suicide bombers who simply walks into an area full of innocent people just to blow themselves up for fun. there is always a target. in all wars there are targets. yet, when america invaded iraq..and so many lives were killed (not to mention not discovering ANYTHING), did they admit to being TERRORISTS themselves??
we cannot rely on the media. WE have to discover the facts ourselves. that is thirst for knowledge. and WHY do people do what they do??? WHY are they so merciless?? WHY are we so selfish?? WHY is the world all about money?? WHY WHY WHY. isn’t this the reality that we are living in? yes..this world is reality now. but look at it…doesn’t it look like it’s coming to an end? and when it does..you reckon you will disappear into think air, and that this will all be forgotten..like in the movies?? are movies reality?? they depict reality?? to a certain extent..they show how humans are vulnerable..and we need a greater Power to save us. not only that..when we do something right, we want to be rewarded..just as we do wrong, we get punished.
i apologize if this is a combination of all sorts..i know it’s a topic that is never-ending if we were to discuss it. it’s just that i do agree with the saying, THE MORE YOU LEARN, THE LESS YOU KNOW. that’s why we need to keep learning, seek knowledge…and never be proud of what you know. cause at the end of it all…the learning process is really the most fun in life
happy learning
cheers!
oh woah. i’m sooo sorry i blogged an entry in your comments page!! *gasp!
Hi again, Dayana, I sympathize with the Muslim cause in the Middle East; I however don’t condone the violence. And I also agree that America’s invasion was “terrorist” in nature. We all know that Bush was only concerned about stealing the oil.
But apart from the American imperialism, think carefully about why the three Abrahamic religions, Judaism, Christianity and Islam are fighting over a barren piece of rock. What is the value of this rock? Is it worth all the fighting and killing?
The reality is that your clerics have led you to believe that a useless piece of rock is worth dying for. What have you learned from centuries of hatred and bloodshed? Absolutely nothing!!!
Please read my next posting later tonight, specifically about religion and hatred.
israelis are the ones who are not satisfied with what they have. for heaven’s sake..it’s only land!! why should we fight for land that we do not own!! people are already living there so what’s the deal?? wipe them all out? that’s the answer??
and that rock..i’m not sure about the rock but what i know is there’s the al-Aqsa mosque. our Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) ascended to Heaven from there. basically there’s a lot of special things that happened that night there and it was also the time God sent us the gift of prayer (salat). it is one of the most holiest site to Muslims. even as earth quakes shattered the mosque a few times it was rebuilt over and over. so israel’s taking over the whole of palestine’s land…it’s crazy..and if they get hold of the mosque..what will happen to it?
if this is all out of hatred..isn’t it the israelis provoking the palestinians to react? this has been far too long and look at the outcome. and if you want to look at it at a religion’s perspective..look at what’s happening to the Muslims. and how they fought back.
i will read your post when i can
and thanks for your replies!
Dayana, I most certainly do not condone what the Israeli’s are doing in Palestine, and like all decent people, am horrified at the death and destruction caused by them in Gaza.
However, back to my discussion about an unnecesary fight over a piece of rock which religious clerics on all three sides claim to be of significance to their religion. You have to admit that if it wasn’t for a religious belief purpetuated by religious clerics, this piece of rock, would only be a stupid piece of rock.
Take a moment to examine the history behind the piece of rock whereupon stands the al-Aqsa Mosque, Temple Mount, Dome of the Rock etc. Examine the history with no religious or emotional bias.
The site is where the Jews built the first temple of Solomon. Around 20BCE King Herod expanded the site and built the second temple. The exact spot where the al-Aqsa Mosque now stands used to be the storehouse of the second temple built by King Herod. Roman Emperor Titus destryed the second temple, including the storehouse in 70CE. Around 530CE, Emperor Justinian built a Christian Church on the site called Church of our Lady. The church was destroyed by Emperor Khosrau II in the 7th century CE. The al-Aqsa Mosque was probably first constructed between 685CE and 705CE, using materials left over from the Church of our Lady. Several reconstructions occurred over the years due to earthquake damage, but was completely rebuilt around 1034 – 1036CE after a major earthquake. During the First Crusade in 1099CE, Jerusalem was captured and the Mosque was used as the headquarters for the Templar Knights. Saladin recaptured Jerusalem in 1187 and some repairs were done to the mosque. The Ottamans seized power in 1517 and undertook some renovations to the Temple Mount area.
In 1969, an extremist evangelical christian called Michael Dennis Rohan tried to burn down the mosque. Apparently the sect he belonged to, Worldwide Church of God believed that they needed to hasten the second coming of Christ, and the rebuilding of the second temple. in the 80’s two Jews tried to blow up the mosque and the Dome of the Rock, hoping that the third temple of Jerusalem could then be built at this site.
So you see, this piece of rock has a long, troubled history of occupation by Jews, Christians and Moslems. All believe that the site has major religious significance to them. It is also evident that there exists a distinct campaigne by some, if not all of these groups to commit horrifying atrocities against their fellow man, which they believe will fulfull scriptural prophesies.
Now after examining the history of the area, any impartial observer can only conclude that were it not for religion, this piece of rock would be as barren as when it was first formed, billions of years ago, many lives could have been spared and much suffering averted. When one looks at this entire saga, critically, the total lack of sound reasoning (also morality and inteligence) by many religious men becomes all too apparent…
Now tell me again why there is so much hatred in the Middle East, and the rest of the crazy religious world. Can you honestly point fingers at who is provoking who? Everyone who practises religion like their scriptures and clerics demand, are guilty and damned. If you fall in this group, you are part of that invidious blot on humanity which has cursed us from the time the first scoundrel dreamt up religion.
Not to be criticizing, but most of your examples about the bad things about religion can also be reflected to atheism. For instance,
“However, back to my discussion about an unnecesary fight over a piece of rock which religious clerics on all three sides claim to be of significance to their religion. You have to admit that if it wasn’t for a religious belief purpetuated by religious clerics, this piece of rock, would only be a stupid piece of rock.”
If we take something, say, the twin towers, we can also replace a few words in that paragraph.
“However, back to my discussion about an unnecesary fight over a bombed tower which the Bush administration claims to be attacked by terrorists. You have to admit that if it wasn’t for the media ” purpetuated by the so called “US Leaders”, this building, would only be a fallen building like any other.”
And referring to your quote in the first post, if it is impossible to attain all knowledge, then what is the use of attaining further knowledge? If religion didn’t exist it would still be the same; eventually people would find something else to blame for limiting their knowledge. Besides, look at our world right now; stem cells, nanotechnology, biotechnology, it seems like that humans are learning a lot right now. Doesn’t seem to me that religion is doing anything to stop it.
Hi Openspeaker,
The difference between the Twin Towers and the Rock, is that the TT was not worshipped as holy by three competing religions. Also the TT did not cause untold misery and suffering by instigating endless fueds, for thousands of years. Yes, Bush used it as an excuse to wage a war for narrow self-interests(for oil), but it is not the same as the rock.
“…then what is the use of attaining further knowledge?”
Strangely, I heard this exact same thing from someone else at work today, and it’s still the most ridiculous thing I’ve probably ever heard. Further knowledge leads to further discoveries in science and technology- the things you take for granted, like being able to use the internet. If we had allowed religion to have sway, then we’d still be stuck back in the stone age, living in caves, hunting for flesh. You cannot have technological progress without scientific method of crutiny, examination, exhaustive experimentation, new learning, trial and error. Without learning you have nothing. A mind full of god only, might as well be totally empty – a zombie.
Actually, you’ve got a point…that the site is a holistic site for all three religions. On the other hand, it paints a picture to me, that whenever a site was destroyed, the next religion rose…and the last was Islam. Though they believe in a God…the Jews reject the thought of Prophet Jesus and thus Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w), therefore Christianity and Islam and the Bible and the Qur’an altogether would mean nothing to them. I cannot say for every Jew, but would they read the Books of God just to find out?
“And God has perfected your religion for you”
As for the Dome of Rock…what makes you think that all this is merely for a piece of rock? Even if it was, don’t you think there is a bigger and hidden agenda behind all of this? If we talk about religion, it is between the Jews and Muslims right? But I won’t say that all Jews and Muslims think the same. There are extremists and they are those who are lost and have gone astray. I mean, in any religion, they do not oppose for war and killing of innocent people. It is even stated in the Qur’an, that the war/battle is against the disbelievers (and this is when THEY attack first!). Even narrated in a hadith, that when they were at war, and this dude spat at this person’s face, he left him.
What Michael Dennis Rohan did, was touch on something so similar between the Christians’ and the Muslims’ beliefs – the second coming of Christ (a.k.a Prophet Jesus). The difference is, to Christians, Christ comes back when the world ends. So Mr. Rohan was hastening the world to come to an end! Muslims believe that he comes back to guide everyone back to Islam (when the world is at its severe corrupted mode…which doesn’t look like it’s too far from now!). On the other hand, I just think that the Jews want to wipe out the Muslims. End of story. And you think the Muslims should just give up and die and give in to what their enemies want? If we want change, we stand up for what’s right, right? That’s how Black Power came right? Out of oppression from the Whites.
Btw, is that acceptable as human rights? We fight for human rights all the time, about all sorts of matters. Heck, even whales have rights and people just cannot stop condemning Japan for their activities. But have you really heard it from Japan’s side of the story?? No. The media is so good at being bad I tell you. But when these things happen, where is the human rights? Sad, isn’t it
I can go about this all day and from every side. The thing is, I am starting to sound like I know everything, when I don’t. This actually gives me an opportunity to discover more about the Jews to be honest with you. I really appreciate your feedbacks, and thank you for all that you’ve shared with me. And I apologize for any negativity I’ve created. But truly, I cannot flood your comments page all the time, and truly, I admit that I need to learn more myself
Nevertheless, it has been an exciting discovery for me…and I’m glad I found your blog Will hope to revisit often and maybe leave you some URLs instead! Hehehe 
“What Michael Dennis Rohan did, was touch on something so similar between the Christians’ and the Muslims’ beliefs – the second coming of Christ (a.k.a Prophet Jesus). The difference is, to Christians, Christ comes back when the world ends. So Mr. Rohan was hastening the world to come to an end!”
Hey looks like when you said:
(when the world is at its severe corrupted mode…which doesn’t look like it’s too far from now!).
It sounds like you are actually hastening the corruption of the world?…I can’t see alot of difference between you and Mr. Rohan.
But I agree with you on human rights. Human do have rights. All humans have rights. Christians, Muslims, atheists, all of us have rights. And we could talk about this for days and days. Perhaps that’s what makes religion so interesting, that it stirs up arguments and such. Heck, I can even say now that if there wasn’t religion there won’t be atheists!
First of all, we would like to tell you that war is decreed in Islam in self defense. This indicates that aim behind war is to ward off aggression not to impose Islam as a religion. Referring to this, Allah Almighty says: “To those against whom war is made, permission is given (to fight), because they are wronged; and verily God is most powerful for their aid.” (Al-Hajj:39)
link: http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaE&cid=1119503545840
and i apologize, it’s not hadith, it is a story..
Caliph Ali was once fighting in a war imposed on Muslims, and the chief of the Unbelievers confronted him. During the fight, the Ali was able to overcome him, who fell down on the ground and Ali was about to kill him. This person, knowing his fate now, had no choice so he spit on the face of Ali. Ali immediately got up and left him alone. The man came running to him and asked, “You had a chance to kill me since I was defeated; how come you didn’t use your sword?” Ali said, “I have no personal animosity toward you. I was fighting you because of your disbelief, on behalf of God. If I had killed you after you spat on my face, then it would have become my personal revenge which I do not wish to take.” That Unbeliever chief became a Muslim immediately.
http://www.islam-usa.com/e80.htm
Hmmm…
Do you believe that everything that happens in life is pre-ordained? That is do you believe that god allows everything that happens for a reason. Take for example, natural disastors such as volcanic eruptions and tsunamis etc. If you do believe this, then consider what I have to say next.
If god ordains that these things must occur (for reasons only he knows) then isn’t it logical that his creation must accept these things as the will of god and allow it to happen? Is this not so? So, if an aggessor makes war on your nation/country, is this not the will of god, and should you not succumb to the aggressor as it is the will of god? Is this not logical? Resisting the aggressor is an act of defiance against the will of god. Is this not so?
I am not implying that an invasion by one country over another (as in the case of America in Iraq) are to be condoned. I make this point simply to show that if you take religious teachings to its natural conclusion, how dumb it really is. Religion was created by man as the effective tool in his arsenal to gain and hold onto power; simply because the basis of all religious teaching is submission. Yes, man wants you to be submissive so that he can control you; this is why he created religion. What better way to acive total control than to make you believe that there is an invisible man in the sky who will punish you upon death, for not submitting to his will. When in reality that will is not the will of god, but the will of devious men. It’s as simple as that. Think about it….
I indeed believe life is pre-ordained; and in a way it WAS logical. But as we can see in Christianity, (I don’t know about Islam though) God gave man a CHOICE of FREE WILL. His creations had the free choice of accepting his will/commands.
In your example of the aggressor and defiance, the resistance is there so the aggressor can realize they can not particularly win without God’s help. If the resistance is eliminated as of God’s will everytime, won’t humans eventually think that they can do it without God’s help and go away from God? They will, and that was particularly why God might have gave us free will in the first place.
An to your last paragraph, you are assuming that the people who first created religion (and therefore that it was created by PEOPLE, not GOD) had no intention of worshipping the religion that they created themselves. But as we can see so often that isn’t the case, the people who “created” their religion indeed followed it as if they didn’t create it at all.
Hi Openspeaker,
There is no free will in submission. According to the bible if you don’t submit to the will of god, then you are dammned. What is the point of giving someone the choice and then condemning them for making one that is not popular with you. It’s like saying choose any colour, so long as it’s black.
Don’t you think that every army that ever went into battle, prayed to god to win. But there is only one winner; why did god forsake the other side? History is kind only to the victorius. Why? Think about sports? Both teams (if they are religious) usually make a big show on the sportsfield of praying for divine intervention and hoping that a god (their god) will make them win. Why does god choose one side over the other, both of the same religious persuasion?
My hypothesis: In stone age times, when the original priests (shamans) began to hallucinate and “see” supernatural beings, and then realyed this to ordinary people, the people were terrified. Unsrupulous people saw this as a unique opportunity to use these spirit creatures as a way of controlling ordinary people through fear. These people are the predecessors of modern-day priests and the clergy who have merely taken this one step further by organizing this fear system into religions. They didn’t have to follow it themselves, but had to make it look credible by doing so. Think about it?
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I’m curious. You state that it is impossible to know everything. Totally agree. Yet, if we don’t possess all knowledge then how do we know that a God does not exist? Wouldn’t we have to know everything there is to know in the universe to be sure God isn’t there? It’s almost a contradiction in a sense. I’m not trying to prod or poke fun, but to understand your reasoning. Please let me know. : )
Hi Amanda,
That is a perfectly valid question. The truth is, we don’t know whether a god or gods exist or not. But don’t you think that it is highly arrogant for a man to propose what he believes a god or gods to be like, and then compound his arrogance with gross dishonesty through coercing the world to accept his version on pain of certain unprovable punishments, or lure of unprovable rewards.
The probability of existence of a god or gods are practically zero, because no proof has ever been scientifically validated for such an existence. Having said that, I don’t think that science can be used to find proof for the existence of a god or gods, but science can be used to evaluate any hypothesis that is offered. Until such proof is found, there is no point in making yourself go nuts over what you visualize a god is, or even worse, what others think.
Well yes, i think it’s arrogant for man to force his beliefs on others through dishonesty or coercion. It’s not exactly fun for someone to come up and say to you that you’re going to hell because you don’t believe in Jesus. And from what I got out of your comments, i think you’ve had to deal with that A LOT. But it is inevitable. Either side you look at it, people are going to get beat up for what they believe. Those who believe in God get mocked by unbelievers and are called fools. Those who don’t believe in God get mocked by the believers and are called fools.
I’m coming to understand what I believe and why I believe it. With each question i study and analyze i come closer to understanding more concretely what I believe. You encourage critical thinking, so is it okay to continue asking questions from someone like yourself with a different perspective who has done extensive research? I have of course, my own thoughts and opinions but i don’t want to continue questioning if it offends you or pressures you.
Hi Amanda,
My only intention is to expose uncritical thinking by providing an alternative based on sound principles of logic and reasoning. Because I think it’s dishonest to mislead people through emotional blackmail. COnsider it a free service, if you will.
I am not in any way on a crusade to win “converts” to any non-religious or other cause. I think this is the impression most people get, because of my passion for speaking out against dishonesty in all areas of life, not just religion.
I think you’re on the right track though: believe whatever you want, practice whatever rituals “float your boat,” but keep it private and out of the public sphere. If’s it gets into the public sphere, then expect criticism.
Greetings all,
I read Amanda’s posts and it basically sums all my opinions up; what an unbeliever says has also another side, just as potent and just as valid. In the end, it come to be neutral. I can’t make you believe in something, you can’t make me. We can try, but in the end it’s the persons own free will and choice. We can’t force someone to do something. And when it does, it often violates both sides of the argument. So I guess I can just end this conversation as of now, and rest peacefully. I hope you all do as well.